3id roukad el sayeddeh, and others...false or true

Dear all,
Yen3ad 3laykon, after the messages by Jana and Elie i thought of starting a new debate concerning our a3yad.

are a3yad like this one, that isn't mentioned in the bible and added later to the liturgy cycle are to be recognized like any other 3id, or they are of less important and we have the choice to be conserned in them or not.

it's a brief but legitimate debate, it conserns what is stable and what is not in our church; If there is such thing as 'not'.

I THINK WE HAVE THE CHOICE IN EVRYTHING OUT THE "DOUSTOUR AL IMAN" AND THE "AL ASRAR"

so can i say that maybe St. Merry didn't ascend to heaven by body, and that maybe some saints are not really saints?

and why al assrar are stable; even though they are numerous in our church ( not just seven). so who can say what are the assrar and what is not.

many questions and explinations. but what is true and what is not

Oui Micho DIB mais pour rendre plus générale, disons nous sommes flexibles en dehors des dogmes, car pas tous les dogmes se trouvent dans le crédo (doustour el2iman) et dans les sacrements.

Oui Micho Derbali, croire que St Marie est montée avec son corps au ciel n'est pas une obligation pour tout croyant.
Les sacrements c'est le travail de l'Esprit dans l'Eglise,
"aimer les plus démunis" est un sacrement.

Mafi true and mich true, Alrouhou youhyi wa lharfou youkayedd!

ur last phrase is nice Rami, but unfortunatly we don't live in heaven, we try to make it heaven as much as we ca.

why should i pray for something didn't happen, are Angels true or not, doe the cherobin and serafin exist or not.

the answer : believe whatever u want ( other then destour el iman) is not always practical and even maybe true

very nice subject micho

pour moi j'accepte tous ce qui est dans le taklid al moukadass , parce qu'on croit que c le travail du saint esprit dans l'eglise!! donc j'accepte tout ce que vous avez cité micho!!

le dernier reponse de micho:" believe whatever u want ( other then destour el iman) is not always practical and even maybe true" ana je ne suis pas tout a fait d'accord coz fi chouhada2 keddisoun esstachhadou men ajel al kalima wal taklid je suis contre :"believe whatever u want " c une phrase protestée

ba3den rami , les icons ne sont pas dans le credo het ta nerfedon !!!!!7achaa , kam ra7elna ediss kermelon!!!!!
je suis contre chabeb

POUR LES icons.....
on peut dessiner car il ya "tajasoud"....
tajasod = icon....
quand on refuse l'icon on refuse altajasod...
mais how "toukaram" al icon is point where we can discuss....
but refusing icon can't be acceptable cause indirectly we a re refusing al tajasoud!!! " wa sar insanan"

Je confirme Micho, et par conséquence rejecter les icones, c en qqsorte rejecter l'incarnation dont parle le crédo

I don't much agry with you dib and Rami,
Do we accept idols (ASNAM), we don't though they could be applied to the idea of incarnation. And

Elias: i think u didn't understand me, the last phrase i wrote " 'Believe wathever u want" i'm not ok with it too as i said in the last part of the phrase "is not always practical and even maybe true"

Second, there is nothing in the Asrar or Destour Iman that talk about Saints, so should i glorify and pray to them or even ignolage them?

ABOUT ASNAM!!!
it's accepted in mean who do it is not out of crhistanity.... but it's not the perfect way to show "altajadous" cause becasue it will show only the human type and not can hardly show God in humans!

about saints....who don't pray in fact exactly to saint but what u do is this relation with dead persons who reach God, which in another therm living the unity of church which wider then place and time!

ahhhh je m'excuse michel derbaly , je n'ai pas bien compris ta phrase!!! ok lakan je suis d'accord avec toi
pour micho and rami , c bien clair qu'il ya beaucoup de choses dans al taklid qui ne sont pas dans le credo...ou bien en relation transitive comme rami a declaré, ana je ne suis pas avec , parce qu'il ya 1000 sujets dans les icons autre que l' incarnation, donc ce n'est pas le bon contre exempl micho!!

Hello
Moi je n'ai pas dit que le crédo contient tous nos dogmes.
Pour les icones, je pense je ne suis pas d'accord, je vais ouvrir un sujeet à ce propos, see you there...

it's okay elias i think we are on the same channel.

As not all our so called believes in the Dogms, can we call them believes or not, What are they?

What about Angels for instance, Nour Ghair el Makhlouk also with St. Gregoire Palams.