Where is our church???????????

after a great debate about Metr. Boulous Famous Article (Hartaka in my opinion) all the orthodox people talk about tis issue and give their opinions and way to solve but we didnt see any official response with or against the Metr. opinions and this is happening in so many important issue and because we are the members of the church that means we are the church so what should we do to let our officials ( the majma3) to take a real descion because it is something realted to our orthodox believe.

i need from all the "2eklirkien" in the group to send to their Metropolite to take a dicesion in this issue.

do you know all the "circonstance" of this speech?
where? why?
and take note that issa ma fi wala ikliriké in our group (till now )

ma fhimit chou ma3nat "circonstance"
i think cirumstances you mean if that it is the majama3 should ask the Metr. this question and must let him explain his opinion to all the church if they show that he is right
and the cirumstances are not important ass much as to know that he write is a HaRTA2A OR NOT

"circoustances": mounasabet elnass. I was saying that you don't know why? where? bishop yazgi had this speech.

for that you don't have the right to shout (capital letter) harata2a.

harta2a is a big word, please don't use it anymore.

Maram relax, your taking the subject very personaly and aggressivly is this a way to treat a brother and father of the church????
now i'm not with what he said -or someone claims he said- definetly im not with, but we can take things easily and be objective with our post, it is very hard to the church at this stage to face a problem with another one. let's not talk fast and think before we talk.
god bless

where is our church??? HERE it is! we are the church and each one has said his opinion .

But to be more frutful and constructive these opinions should be said directly to the bishop instead of spreading it over the internet.

Can't we (as MJO) have an interview with met Boulos and discuss this issue with him? or it's just a matter between "2iklirikyin"?

I didn't participate in the debate about this article but i read all the replies and i noticed that the majority of us were against it but also some of us defended the bishop so i think that if we continue this way we'll have problems with each other (mnetkhena2 ma3 ba3ed) instead of solving the issue!

so? what do u think? what about a mou2tamar in mjo about this problem?

no i am not aggresive but when something related our "3akiyde" we cannot stay without doing anything but we have to defind our faith i cannot imagine that till now no one from almajma3 said or wirte or give opinion in this issue
it is very strange and make afraid that their is no one to dfend our faith in the Majma3.

Jana we are the church correct but also "Majma3" houwi mowakal ydafe3 3an al2iyman w lazim yel3ab dawrou hata law badou yser fi machakil la2nou ma hada lazim ymis bi 3a2edetna

i agree with mouram!!!
the majma3 have a role to play.... and why he's not playing it?
it's not accepted that the majma3 didn't discuss that article... he must discuss it to see the "circonstance", and to agree on it or to refuse it!!!! and to say why!!!

Heeyyyyyyy. tawwlo belkon shway . 3am erja3 e2ra el makal 3a rawe2. Ma fi Mass bel 3akidi.
el zalameh 3am ye7keh 3an ramadan. w fi ktiiiir ashya 7elweh ala. w farja mafahim lal sawm ne7na men emin fia wel moumeraset el sha3biyeh el islemieh shawaheta
ex:
شهر رمضان، شهر نجوع فيه حتى أن البطون الخاوية والشفاه اليابسة تعف عما من التراب لتحيا على ما في الروح، شهر رمضان تتفرغ فيه القلوب للتقوى ومناجاة الله وخشيته، يوقظ هذا الشهر القلوب ويجعلها لينة رقيقة ويلهب فيها حرارة الإيمان، إنه ( رقة بالقسوة والحرمان).‏‏‏

....
يستقبل رمضان بالتوبة الصادقة والرجوع إلى الذات وبالصلاة، ليس رمضان شهر جوع نهار وشبع ليل! ولا نهم في الليل وعطش في النهار، يجعل البعض من شهر رمضان موسم طرب وسهر وسمر لإباحة الجسد وأسر الروح، فيستبدلون مجرد الليل بالنهار،
....

So I think there is no Herracy nor the issue need a conference to solve it.
Enno el we7id biyestaghrib leh nkatab el makal min kibla moutran. bass ma badda hal 2add.

fouad, as we all know, in this article, met boulous, "or who ever claims he wrote" did say that the kouraan "2ounzila fi shahr ramadan", the word "2ounzil" is the problem since it wasn't followed by "in the muslim religion" as if he agrees that the kour2an is "mounzal" this is our problem,
now we can discuss the whole article as a litterature is verry good, but we canot link it to our faith and acceptance of what muslim ppl beleive, w eare definatly against that beleif

yes fouad what about a met. saying that kour2an 2ounzil!!!

yimkin ana 3am shouf el oumour men gheir zewyeh. yimkin ma3ak 7a22 mich fia w ma fia. enno bel nesbeh la2elna ma fi enzel. sa77. Bass hone baddak tshouf iza el sayedna 3am yetbanna hal wejhet el nazar ka iman walla ka Adab.

ma fiyatkoun adab,
lama sayedna george khoder bie7keh 3an mouhamad bi2oul "nabiy al islam", heik bitkoun adab!!
w ana akid mich 3akideh hiyeh bilnesbeh la2aleh ghalta min sayedna!!! w lezem titsala7 biser3a!!!

elmotran repeated a verset like it exists in Coran
wa ka2anni bihi yakoul:
atoum takoulouna anna "...wa injila ounzila fi ramadan...."
so ramadan is very important month "to you"...

hayda mich ta3lim lal2alna, specially this is not an article, it is a speech said in a ramadan iftar, where all was muslims

Unfortunately i'm not being able to send the respond done by one of the fathers, it's posted in the MJO group mail, if ny can poste it, it will be great (Rami?)

read thios article " dini wa din al 2akhar" from this site: http://www.alepporthodox.org/ar_index.html

this is a reply from " الأرشمندريت إيليا طعمه "

when u enter the site enter : رسالة الرعية
then look in the "fahras"
then go to the nachra of 4th november
then read the article " ديني ودين الآخر "

why the Metr. himself replies and say his opinion loudly?
???????/

mannou méttar ya habibé
i think it is more useful if you post a new "moussmér" subject

thanks Jana, this is the article that i was talking about.

it's nice to clarify this matter, though i believe that the Mtr. should have clarified it on a larger scale. the first article was published under his name in el thawra magazine as i read in MJO group, so a respond was proper to clarify the matter in a similar magazine.
plus i don't think that even like this it is acceptable from a christian bishop.

plus dear Rami, where is the problem in such discussions. this is a real issue. like all our problems in Kursi al Antaki. huge changes are made in the back doors and no one speaks of it. just read the MJO group mails about balamand institute to see that there are major issues and no one speakes of it. shouldn't we as MJO speake of it at least.

Mich,
car critiquer ne contruit guère
tous les posts étaient genre lézim nhasbou, w lézim ntayro, w wén elknissé....

Je suis tout à fait d'accord pour discuter, de tout aussi
mais objectivement, et scientifiquement
c'est plus fructif je pense de discuter les circonstances, de ce qui va et de ce ne qui va pas avec ce discours posté dans le journal syrien.

en effet, est ce que tu peux me trouver un article, juste 1, écrit par mjo, sur ce "ma 2élo ha2 hal khouri inno ma ynéwél...", w "lézim ybattil khouri"...

les mjo ont expliqué la necessité de reprendre la communion régulière, et ont ainsi réussi à l'installer sans aucune critique stérile .

celui qui critique n'a pas le temps de construire

dear rami you have to criticise first to know the problem.
in our case there is an article published by a Bishop that diverts from the right path, what should we do in regard to that?
we should discuss it criticise it, like everything else, then get to somewhere, of course criticise in a scientific way as you have said.
i don't see a problem in what was done exept for the bad words sometimes used.
what do you suggest we should have done in this case other than what i have said?
do something without any discussion for the article, the situation in here is the article nothing else and if the bishop did wrong or right.

sure Mich, as i said before we should discuss "Bishop that diverts from the right path", right or true?
discuss scientific way
what was wrong what was right?

for tanzil, he was just repeating the coran verses to the muslims sitting in front of him
it was not a teach to christians.
i think our "houjoum" was little over.

we should not shout after reading just an article on the internet, that this bishop should be out, and where is our church to put him out....
did you read the article sent by Jana, what do you think, are you ok, not ok?

By the way, yen3ad 3leik boul mich, lyounira laka errabo souboulahou fatahya fi dia2ihi...

thank you dear Rami,
of course i read the article, sice i was the one who proposed it earlier but couldn't post it.

this explains a lot of course but still there is something fishy and strange.
dear all i propose to discuss an another article which is more important and describes the true nature of MJO and speaks of its threats noadays.
it's the last article for Bishop Khoder in the al Nour.